I am relatively new to gardening and am having a horrible time with my garden this year. My pumpkins have powdery mildew, won't grow, the female flowers won't open or just fall off. My other squash plants won't do a thing and are all dying, as are some of my other plants. I am becoming very discouraged and I'm trying to be all natural and organic but what is the trick? Why is miracle grow bad and why does it work for all my chemical loving neighbors while I'm the failure organic lady. I live in northern IL where the spring was late and very cold and the rainfall has been ridiculously too much. My apologies for my ranting but I feel close to throwing in the trowel.

Well, first off, take a deep breath & don't even THINK about throwing in the towel. Everyone has a bad year now & then. It happens.

Second - what is your garden setup like? As in - soil, mulch, sunlight, how everything is planted, etc.?

That'll help in trying to figure out what's happening. Chin up!

pumpkin lady,
I live in northern Illinois too and I have pumpkins and gourds. Its all trial and error. I started mine indoors this year and waited to plant outside till June. I have more problems with deer than anything else. Hang in there, you'll be glad you did.
Where are you in Illinois?
datgirl

A major cause of mildew is that the foliage of the plants is kept wet or is watered or rained on late in the day and then remains wet overnight. Switching to chemicals will not change this, but careful selection of varieties that are well adapted to your region will help.

You can find help specific to Illinois here: http://web.extension.uiuc.edu/state/hort.html

Then too, you need to work on soil health. Once you have healthy soil, you will rarely need to worry about applying chemical fertilizers or pesticides. Have your soil tested and be sure that you let your lab know that you want recomendations for organic methods of improving your soil.

What's wrong with M____ G____

Basically the problem with blue chemical fertilizer is that, while it gives plants a shot in the arm that unquestionably makes them shoot up and grow, the chemicals persist in the soil afterward, inhibiting the health, and eventually killing off the soil organisms that help integrate organic material, such as earthworms.

Over time the soil becomes saturated with chemical salts and less and less hospitable to plant life. It then requires increasingly greater quantities of chemicals to force anything to grow at all.

As those chemicals build up in the soil, increasing amounts run off or seep down to the water table. Either way they end up in our creeks, streams and rivers, and eventually in our lakes and oceans.

As they flow into the lakes and oceans they stimulate the rapid growth and then death of algae. The dead and dying algea depleats the oxygen dissolved in the water, creating massive dead zones outside the mouths of our major rivers and killing off the marine life within those zones.

Once these zones were small and merely hindered sea life. Now they are large, extending tens or hundreds of miles out to sea and destroying estuarial life forms that are not able to swim out from under the algae cloud.

But aside from saving the planet, chemical fertilizers and pesticides are made of stuff that you just shouldn't eat.

Also, before you get too depressed, It might make you feel better to read my very first post here, written at the end of a season when I was frequently tempted to till the whole thing under and plant sod.

http://forums.organicgardening.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/2...691037741#1691037741

"I am relatively new to gardening..."



You can't be that new. I just started 2-08 and have been studying it up like part time job. And I don't know a thing about answering your problems...or even about asking your questions?

I will encourage you to keep on keeping on.

I'd starve to death is I had to feed myself on what I grow. I feel like giving up many times. But, the reality of our world is food shortages will be more prevalent as we delve deeper in peak oil issues.

So no matter how disgusted I get, I have to eat and have to learn on how to grow food the best I can.

Just look at my latest successes. I still can't sprout veggies after almost 6 months of trying.




With the recent food shortages in the news I have to wonder as Richard Heinberg brought up "Who will be growing our food 20 years from now?"

"The average American farmer is 55 to 60 years old. The proportion of full time farmers younger than 35 years of age has dropped from 15.9% in 1982 to 5.8% in 2002. Who will be growing our food 20 years from now?" from "Peak Everything" by Richard Heinberg

"Amish farmers can't compete in conventual agriculture farming. 40 years ago 90% to 95% of the Amish were farmers. Today less than 10% are farmers." Ffrom: "How the Amish Survive" DVD

We have been worshiping the wrong God all these years. We should have been making farmers our God.

We should have been worshiping the farmer and doing everything we could to make their life a better one and kiss their asses for producing healthy and nutritious food for us.

Our food supply has degenerated unbelievably in recent years and getting worse every day that goes by. A societies well-being is based on healthy food that the farmer produces.

Just as cows go mad with poisonous, unnatural diet - so will society.

People will be headed off the deep end more and more as global warming starts to cook us, the oil and natural gas dries up and our excessive desires cannot be fulfilled any longer.

If the poison food does not drive us crazy, the salty and unnatural combinations and nutritionally bankrupt content will do the job as we get cooked from the inside with EMF and radio wave radiation for every direction.

The food being fed to us is factory made, genetically engineered, poison. But besides the greed for money, the drive for GMO food is that of necessity. We are overpopulated and our land is devoid of nutrition so they monkey with the food to try and keep pace with the insatiable demands of feeding the US.

In addition, there are not enough farmers in the US to feed us any other way than the way they do now. If the US went to organic farming with the same amount of farmers we have now - we would starve to death.

"In 1935, the number of farms in the United States peaked at 6.8 million as the population edged over 127 million citizens. There are over 285,000,000 people living in the United States. Of that population, less than 1% claim farming as an occupation."

http://www.epa.gov/oecaagct/ag101/demographics.html

If we look at the trends of farming in the US it goes in just one direction ... DOWN.

Much of the citrus groves in Fla and CA are disappearing due to skyrocketing real estate values. You know farming is tough work and many times nature deals you a blow with disease, pests and inclement weather that destroys crops.

So why would a farmer want to put up with all that when they could get $5,000,0000 or $10,000,000 for prime real estate?

http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2007/Oct/19/bz/hawaii710190345.html

http://www.californiagreensolutions.com/cgi-bin/gt/tpl.h,content=1039

It is really a tough life 'just finding' some decent food to eat nowadays unless you happen to live in a town with a good natural grocer and have lots of money. But money is still no guarantee. I bought some 'organic peaches' last summer at Krogers for $3 a pound...they rotted before the ripened ....went straight in the trash.

When I was a kid growing up in L.A. we could pick apricots from a tree in the alley and they had fabulous flavor even when somewhat green. What do you get now with apricots...tasteless rubber for $3 a pound.

The peaches have lost their fuzz since they are picked green, buffed and waxed with poisons and anti fungals. You can't wash it off either.

Soak a buffed peach in water and you will get a rainbow oil slick on the surface of the water composed of poison...no matter how many times you rinse it. Each summer I make it my mission to try and find a few edible peaches with the fuzz still on them...I usually fail unless I drive great distances and luck into a 'real' farmers market. (I've noticed some roadside farmers stands just buy their produce in normal channels to resell)

We will run out of natural gas, just as we deplete our crude supplies in the near future. Our population boom was fueled by synthetic fertilizers made from natural; gas. Once the natural gas dries up so does the fertilizer and a shortage of fertilizer equals a shortage of food...aka STARVATION!

http://www.amazon.com/High-Noon-Natural-Gas-Energy/dp/1931498539

I think we have a real food crisis brewing for the world. Not enough young farmers replacing the old, we will run low of fertilizer as the NG dries up and that food which is grown is devoid of nutrition and not healthy.

Hi Pumpkin lady! Welcome to the adventuresome world of organic gardening! Do NOT give up! Some years are better than others, but it is all a process... learning is a big part of that. I have just joined this forum & can say that I am having issues with my pumpkins, too. But other areas are looking good. I think you have all the rain we are missing here in RI (no rain for me at all in over 3 weeks). Powdery mildew happens. I have read that there is sadly no cure. I'd suggest cutting your losses where your squash is & amending the soil a bit & plant something else... mustard greens are easy & prolific, maybe some bush beans, and/or beets?! Just wanted to offer you a little encouragement- good for you giving up the miracle grow!! Cheers.

Hi Pumpkin Lady. I know what you mean about feeling like throwing in the trowel. I'm having an "off" season myself, after an awful lot of hard work. Don't do it. You'll learn a bunch and next year will be better.

Meanwhile, some fish fertilizer may help you get through this dark spell of M------- G--- temptation. Our local greenhouse sells it by the gallon. Can you find some nearby where you live?

By the way, I'm hoping I'll actually get some pumpkins this year. Last yr they froze out before any were ripe. I'm thinking about a 2-week headstart inside should be about perfect for next season, based on this year's experiments.

Pumpkin Lady, don't give up! I'm new to this board as well and this is my second year of trying to grow things organically. Last year I planted zucchini and got nothing by leaves and flowers that fell off, this year I've picked six in the last two days and there are more coming. What I'm getting from all of this is that organic gardening takes time. I expect it will take years before my soil is at a place where I can feed my family with some regularity. Mildew happens, miracle grow won't cure it.

First what is your soil like? What did a good, reliable soil test tell you about the soils pH and nutrient level? Did you do any of these simple soil tests,
1) Structure. From that soil sample put enough of the rest to make a 4 inch level in a clear 1 quart jar, with a tight fitting lid. Fill that jar with water and replace the lid, tightly. Shake the jar vigorously and then let it stand for 24 hours. Your soil will settle out according to soil particle size and weight. A good loam will have about 1-3/4 inch (about 45%) of sand on the bottom. about 1 inch (about 25%) of silt next, about 1 inch (25%) of clay above that, and about 1/4 inch (about 5%) of organic matter on the top.

2) Drainage. Dig a hole 1 foot square and 1 foot deep and fill that with water. After that water drains away refill the hole with more water and time how long it takes that to drain away. Anything less than 2 hours and your soil drains too quickly and needs more organic matter to slow that drainage down. Anything over 6 hours and the soil drains too slowly and needs lots of organic matter to speed it up.

3) Tilth. Take a handful of your slightly damp soil and squeeze it tightly. When the pressure is released the soil should hold together in that clump, but when poked with a finger that clump should fall apart.

4) Smell. What does your soil smell like? A pleasant, rich earthy odor? Putrid, offensive, repugnant odor? The more organic matter in your soil the more active the soil bacteria will be and the nicer you soil will smell.

5) Life. How many earthworms per shovel full were there? 5 or more indicates a pretty healthy soil. Fewer than 5, according to the Natural Resources Conservation Service, indicates a soil that is not healthy.
to see what your soil was like and make any improvements indicated by those tests.
Powdery Mildew occurs on some plants because the weather conditions, temperature and humidity, are in the range that is conducive to its growth, not because foliage was wet, or watered or rained on late in the day.
Miracle Grow will make plants look healthy in kind of the same way steroids might help someone develop muscles, but over the long run it is, like the steroids, unhealthy and will create far more problems than it cures.

Oh my goodness - thank you all so much for the advice and I do apologize for my whining. It is so important to do what we are doing even if it is hard, the benefits as a whole do outnumber the difficulties. I feel much inspired and ready to tackle my garden again(with tlc of course). I do need to do a soil test although My gardens are raised beds that I ammended with organic compost and soil so I guess I thought that was enough but no more shortcuts for me. I have a theory - tell me what you think - the property that my subdivision was built on was an old farm. They are not organic out here. Could it be that the soil is still suffering from the abuse of days gone by? How long does it take for chemicals to breakdown in the soil. Also, do we as gardeners ever need to worry about soil contaminants ourselves such as E coli from bunny poop etc. I have been studying organic gardening since I started last year but it only raises more questions. Thanks again.

Building good soil doesn't happen in one shot - if you continually add good organic matter and cultivate a healthy soil community of microbes, fungi, worms, etc. you will soon overcome any shortfalls you may have started with (unless it's seriously contaminated w/ heavy metals or the pH is wildly out of range. A soil test could help determine if those are issues.)

Any manure you are adding to your soil (bunny poop, etc.) should be properly composted before adding to your planting beds - doing so will eliminate most pathogens.

As for your pumpkins & squash - good aeration and direct sunlight help deter powdery mildew. Your wet, rainy conditions are probably a factor. In years past, I grew my squash in the corner of a fenced yard. By mid-summer, when temps and humidity soared, they developed powdery mildew. This year, I moved them to a sunnier plot away from the corner and built an A-frame support for them to climb. It gets lots of air circulation above and below and the height of the frame allows them to get more sun. I do have more vine borers this year (more exposed stems) but no sign of PM.

Don't despair - study and make note of what conditions you grew your crops in this year and use that information to improve your planning next year.

quote:

the property that my subdivision was built on was an old farm.

It's fairly standard practice when on good farmland to bulldoze the loam out of the way (less mud to deal with), then after the construction is done to spread just enough back for a lawn...selling the extra loam for a profit. Even not so good farmland, you'll bulldoze the topsoil out of the way and spread it back later.

quote:

They are not organic out here. Could it be that the soil is still suffering from the abuse of days gone by? How long does it take for chemicals to breakdown in the soil.

Organic certification standards call for three years.

I have read of one organic grain farmer in Washington or Oregon way who grows in small fields in mountain valleys, away from the active grain growing areas of his state today.

He tests his fields, and has some he's refused to lease that still show trace amounts of DDT -- which was banned 40 years ago.

Many organic gardens / farms will be exposed to trace amounts of chemicals, too -- 2,4D that has volatized in the air (although much less of a problem then years ago), or Glyphosate that is delivered by rain.

In general, soil has an amazing ability to heal itself from the insults of synthetic pesticides over given time. Like Matt-choo said stuff like heavy metals, pH, and salt maybe tougher or take longer to deal with.

quote:

Also, do we as gardeners ever need to worry about soil contaminants ourselves such as E coli from bunny poop etc.

Absolutely.