quote:

Originally posted by adirondackgardener:

gridgardener, I suggest you re-read the the scenario, perhaps paying a bit of attention this time. If you need help looking up "non-commercial" in the dictionary, please don't hesitate ask any of us. We're here to help.

Wayne

PS. Sorry Wayne, I keep getting sidetracked and forget where I/we were?

quote:

PS. Sorry Wayne, I keep getting sidetracked and forget where I/we were?

I believe someone was saying, "I'm not touching you!" and the other was saying, "Stop touching me!"

The mental image of this group as a bunch of 8 year olds in a van on a long trip is entirely too humorous to me

quote:

Al Gore!

Too many electric cars - no global warming, no crusade, no academy award, no peace prize, no $100 mil check in the hip pocket. It was a vast left wing conspiracy!

Do I smell smoke?... Yes, I definitely do smell smoke. Wierd...who's trying to blow smoke up our butts???

Wayne

Oh, by the way, gridgardener, There will be no new drilling until it is necessary. Those our our last reserves and they are not there for idiots to waste.

Americans do not deserve cheaper gasoline until they get Hummers off the road, stop oil speculators from running up the price of oil and get the courage to stand up to the oil company execs and tell them price gouging will cost you years in jail time.

That is why all you who are crying for new drilling will have to wait. Americans have to grow up and be learn to be responsible first.

What we need is a leader who will face reality and have the balls to tell America that times are hard, that we need to start doing some of the hard things for ourselves, that we can't keep wasting resources even though Dick Cheney told we are entitled to do so. We're not. Grow up and get over it.

We need a leader that will tell us the we are at war and we all may need to make some sacrifices until it is done, one way or another. We don't need some limp-brained fool telling us that the response to attacks on our country is to take the American Express Card and go shopping and visit Disneyland. We don't need some irresponsible, economics dimwit to tell us that "don't worry, I, can give you everything you want, even though I am running two wars and the economy down the toilet. I still can sell treasury bonds that some fools down the road will have to pay for. (Heh, I don't even have grandchildren so who gives a flying ....)"

So when Americans can show they not only need cheaper gas, but that they deserve it, then come running to me and tell me that Democrats are making you pay more.

Until then, stop your whining.

Wayne

quote:

Those our our last reserves and they are not there for idiots to waste.

No, but you do use them to
a) Lessen the influence of numerous governments such as Saudi Arabia, Iran, Nigeria, and Venezula that make the Bush administration look progressive and competent
b) To keep the money inside the nation; while one can rightly complain about $200 Billion war, that transfer of wealth pales in comparison to $700 Billion currently going overseas (particulary the $3-400 Billion outside of North America; trade with Mexico and Canada isn't very damaging). That's money that would be paying Americans to work and being spent locally and generating taxes on the local, state, and federal levels. Instead of building modern castles in Dubai and helping Hugo Chavez arm the FARC.
c) Particularly if you believe carbon based fuels will decline in use precipitously, it's of best economic advantage to exploit them sooner then later and bring the money home. Let's say you see you combine conservation to reduce future growth in energy demand as our population continues to grow; couple that with the Picken's Plan to replace the 20% of our power from natural gas with wind; add to it expansion of nuclear from 20% to 40% to reduce our domestic need for coal...and then sell the coal to China. They are burning coal twice as fast and have one fourth as much as we do. There's people who complain about the debt held by China, well...pay it off. We have the natural resources to do so. And we can also design world class plans for wind turbines, generators driven by off shore currents, nuclear plants, improved hybrid cars (and natural gas engines) and sell those designs and build key components for export them and the rest of the world as well.

It's time to use those resources wisely for our own economic good, not to propose crippling the economy by denying low cost energy or continuing sending hundreds of billions of dollars to other nations instead of using domestic resources just to make a point that you don't agree with how people use energy.

Is there any credible source that says US oil reserves can approach the output of our mid-east suppliers?

I heard these same arguments back in the 70s when the debate was to despoil Alaska's wilderness to build a pipeline that would open up the North Slope to drilling at Prudhoe Bay.

The single-most important deciding factor for Congress was that, by law, the oil produced in Alaska would stay in the United States to provide relief for Americans. Almost as soon as the first drop of oil began flowing, Alaska's Oil-Whore Senator Stevens began lobbying to allow shipping it out of the country where it could be sold for higher prices and eventually, under the Newt Gingrich regime, Congress gave the ok to export Alaskan oil.

Combine that with the fact that the oil company running the operation in Alaska is British Petroleum and tell me that, despite "guarantees" from Congress, the money is going to stay in this country if and when new drilling sites are opened up.

By the way, it is only about 30 years and the oil fields at Prudhoe Bay that promised to give us "independence from foreign oil" are running out. For how long, precisely, will we achive "independence" this time?

Wayne

quote:

Originally posted by adirondackgardener:
...who's trying to blow smoke up our butts???

quote:

Al Gore!

I thought the answer was obvious!
Really don't like correcting others grammar but the above is all messed up, should be "...who is blowing smoke up our butts???

Dirt

PS. No need to thank me!

quote:

Originally posted by Dirt Pit:



Dirt

PS. No need to thank me!

I do believe you are correct in this regard.

Wayne
Who's off to work in the garden now.

quote:

Wayne
Who's off to work in the garden now.

Enjoy!

Dirt

PS. BTW, enjoyed the photos you posted elsewhere of you garden.

The contraction for "who + is", is, indeed, "who's". We could argue about the definition of "is" however.

quote:

Originally posted by adirondackgardener:
...What we need is a leader who will face reality and have the balls to tell America that times are hard, that we need to start doing some of the hard things for ourselves, that we can't keep wasting resources....

I'm thinking that's not quite what Phil Gramm was telling us the past few days...

Wayne,

You wrote:

quote:

For your consideration...A gas MPG Executive Order

I hope that's just a bit of facetiousness on your part. In another thread you took a poster to task for "speculating about what the [constitution] says rather than actually reading what it says.

If there is ANYTHING more unconstitutional than a presidential executive order applying to ANYTHING other than executive branch rules and regulations I don't know what it could possibly be!
The Constitution makes it quite clear that ONLY congress shall make laws. Hell, if the POTUS has the power to make law we might just as well hand him a crown and a scepter and be done with it!

Of course, you're right Weed. Last thing I want to do is give a certain someone in Washington even more ideas of how to grossly abuse his office.

Wayne

quote:

Originally posted by adirondackgardener:
Of course, you're right Weed. Last thing I want to do is give a certain someone in Washington even more ideas of how to grossly abuse his office.

Wayne

I trust that same sentiment applies to all political persuasions? Not that I look forward to the possibility.

Dirt

PS. I look forward to the day when we have a bright light shining on everyone in Washington who abuse their office. I sometimes think you you're under the impression that corruption is only in one political party. Just for the record let me define corruption (as I see it) - I examine every detail of a Democrat politician's job and personal affairs (as relates to his job) and vote for him because he's honest and above reproach, even though I disagree with him politically.